20 comments on “The Greater Exodus?

  1. I hadn’t heard of the “greater exodus”, guess I haven’t been around long enough yet. I agree with what you said, so thanks for the “heads up” 😉

    It sounds like Christians talking about the “rapture”. I grew up being taught that we’d be “on the first flight out”, but as I studied the Word myself it seemed less and less like that lined up with Scripture. Then I started looking into where the whole rapture theory came from… Jesuit priests in the 1400 and 1500’s… that pretty much sealed it for me. Anyway, it seems like people don’t want to go through tribulation, yet all through the epistles I read that we will be persecuted. It is to be expected, not shyed away from, and we should rejoice if we are counted worthy to suffer shame for the Name of Yeshua. That means we are doing something right, lol!

    I like how you brought up the issue with those who would try to prepare or put their trust in human efforts. Either Yahveh is enough or He isn’t. That goes for everyday life. Where is our trust, our faith? Is His Word true or not?

    We should not be trying to “help” Him out by getting supplies ready or trying to force His hand by heading to Israel on our own.

  2. Hey Annie, These “greater exodus” adherents do believe that we’ll be here during the tribulation. It’s just that they think God is calling them home after a particular event happens. So I think they’re going to walk to Israel, I don’t know. The bottom line is that they would be doing it in the flesh and in their own timing. The Lord will gather us when He returns so there’s no need to do this in the flesh. Plus what if they’re wrong about the kickoff event? Say the altar is dedicated, they leave, they’re traveling for years, no Savior, then what? Plus I don’t believe another temple or altar will be rebuilt but that’s another post. With any denomination or movement, you’ll always have some strange teachings. It is SO important to check absolutely everything you hear with scripture.

    Today was quite an amazing day for me. I learned so much today and not just from my parsha study. I got an understanding about something that’s plagued and confused me for 10 years. I read it once today, thought about it for a minute, then it was crystal clear!j

    Two other things – the same thing. And the funny thing is it makes sense JUST AS IT IS WRITTEN. If we are willing to put aside our preconceived notions about things, and believe the words in front of us, amazingly we’ll have no trouble. I’m going to post on two of these things in the future but the other one I think I’ll just keep to myself because I may be the only one who had trouble with it. I can see it now, someone would say “you didn’t understand that Einstein???” haha So yeah, I might keep that one to myself. haha But I’ll tell you in an email if you want. 🙂

  3. Carol, Great post! You took a complicated topic and broke it down so that everyone can understand it. May I add one small point?

    Near the end, you referenced Jeremiah 17:5: “A curse on the person who trusts in humans, who relies on merely human strength”. This dovetails nicely with Matthew 6:19-21.

    19 Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal.
    20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys, and thieves do not break in and steal:
    21 for where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

    These “greater exodus” people who are counting on being “gathered and returned” to Israel before the proper time, who are storing up goods for that trip, are merely storing up treasure on earth. It certainly appears as if they are trusting in themselves (humans) and do not appear as if they are trusting the Lord to do what He says He will do.

    I really appreciate all the effort that you put into making this such an informative site!

  4. Were the 5 wise virgins “wise” because they purchased enough provisions to last until they WENT OUT to meet the groom? Were the 5 wise virgins “storing up wealth” on earth? Messiah tells us that the final generation will witness times like in the days of Noah. Noah was ridiculed for obtaining physical necesities in anticipation of hard times. It appears that foolish virgins are looking for excuses NOT to prepare, all the while ridiculing the wise virgins.

  5. The context is when Messiah will come. It is a message to us to be ready for His return. We won’t know the ‘day or the hour,’ exactly but like the five wise virgins, we are to be ready. So what do you think Messiah expects from us in order to be ready for His return? The husband is coming for His bride so what should she do to prepare? Should she pack survival gear and food and perhaps a tent? Will not our Husband provide all of these things for us? He’ll give us a home/mansion so we won’t need a tent. He’ll provide food at the wedding feast so we don’t have to store up food for ourselves. And we don’t have to worry about our survival because He IS life and will give us eternal life with Him. Remember, the context is Messiah’s return, not the 3 1/2 yrs leading up to it.

    So you see, in context, the parable you’re referring to cannot mean to store up goods and gear beforehand. A husband would never require a bride to collect a bunch of things for herself because he is her provider, and in this case He is our Provider, our shelter, Comforter, our everything IF we trust in Him.

    A bride would prepare by readying herself for her husband. She is to wash her robes so that she is presented to Him without spot or wrinkle. She is to be living in obedience so that she is blameless. She is to trust him for all of her needs. There are many verses on this so please look them up.

    Thanks for stopping by. Shalom! 🙂

    • God didn’t provide a home/mansion for the people in the first exodus. They had to provide their own sukkah and household items ( kneading bowls, etc…) Manna didn’t show up for 30 days. Where do you find any biblical support that we are free from any obligation to obtain provisions? Isn’t the point of observing Shabbat and the moedim to teach us to spiritually AND materially for God’s appointed times? God doesn’t make food appear in my house during Shabbat, rather I have to plan ahead and obtain material provisions for my family to last through Shabbat and the moedim.

      • The whole purpose of the first exodus was the freeing of Yahweh’s bride from bondage.(Egypt) And the purpose of the REAL exodus is the same – to free us from bondage but instead of Egypt being the house of bondage, it is worldwide – which makes the “greater exodus” greater. If you gather yourself and go away from cities, you are not freeing yourself from bondage because the world and its corruption will still be intact. The REAL exodus, that happens when Messiah returns and gathers His people, is truly freeing us from bondage in that He destroys world governments and He rules and reigns as King Priest. At that time, Israel also gets their inheritance – the land of Israel.

        The message we are to glean from the Israelites gathering their food each day is not one of gathering, but one of trusting Yahweh for their daily provision. They ran out of food daily and could not store up extra for the future except for preparation day. If they did, it would spoil. And the food they originally packed when they first left Egypt ran out which is why HE PROVIDED the manna a few weeks later. Hopefully you can see that the message we are to learn from with the original exodus is of trusting Yahweh for everything and He provides.

        As far as the weekly shabbat – of course we are to prepare for it. But observing the weekly shabbat has nothing to do with this greater exodus myth where people gather as much food and supplies as they can carry to wait on a call from Yahweh that’s never going to come because the whole thing not only violates his character but it also isn’t commanded nor is there a picture for us to emulate. How’s that for a run-on sentence? 🙂

        As for the verses about how “we are free from any bligation to obtain provisions.”…..

        Matt 6:19 Do not store up for yourselves treasure on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. But store up for yourselves treasure in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

        Matt 6:25 Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more important than food, and the body more important than clothes? Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they?

        Matt 6:28 And why do you worry about your clothes? See how the lillies of the field grow. They do not labor or spin. Yet I tell you that not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these. If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, will he not much more cloth you, O you of little faith?

        Matt 6:31 So do not worry saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.

        Yeshua gives us the message not to worry about food, drink, clothing etc. He says to seek His kingdom and all of these things will be given to us.

        The bottom line is that if you are really searching for the truth, the Spirit of Truth WILL reveal it to you. But if want to continue to believe this popular greater exodus lie and follow the crowd, then you will. Blessings 🙂

  6. Carol – You would make a wonderful flashlight! Flashlights exist to shine light into the darkness, and your comments certainly do that. I just want to mention one small thing, for your further education regarding these “greater exodus” proponents.

    You quoted Matthew 6:19: “Do not store up for yourselves treasure on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. But store up for yourselves treasure in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.”

    The “greater exodus” proponents are already very familiar with this verse. That’s why they also stockpile weapons…. because they know there will be thieves.

    Here’s an article that I wrote on the subject of stockpiling for the “greater exodus:”

    http://theecclesiastesproject.wordpress.com/2012/04/11/stockpiling-and-the-greater-exodus/

    • Shalom I would love to read your article mentioned. It keep say it is protected. Leona from Soutn Africa

    • I know of no one “stock piling ” for a greater exodus. I know Torah believers that try to have food on hand for a few months. It is common sense to me to have ammo to protect our families because of dangerous situations. If someone chooses not to, their business.
      I’m not even sure about the greater exodus because Matt. 24:29-31 says following the trouble of those times…….. His angels will appear and His chosen will be gathered from one end of heaven to the other. That could be the exodus.

  7. Hey Andrew Holdings, no use trying to explain as they refuse to place your comments when their belief is proven wrong. Check out “the project manager’s” blog which he gives a link to and see where they refused listing any of my further comments…..even asking me why I spend so much time on their blog ! Can you imagine ?

    These guys will stay behind and face the same fate as the Nations will face or those swimming around the boat of Noah.

    Carol try Googling the following :

    1. Truso Kist.
    2. Who is the Woman in Revelation 12.

    Shalom
    Bob.

    • Hello Bob. I tried looking up “Truso Kist” and “Truso Kist who is the woman in revelation 12” and I couldn’t find a domain with “Truso Kist” or anything on that topic with that name. Anyway, I’ll be the first to admit that I do NOT have Revelation down. I have been studying Revelation on and off for years and every now and then, the Lord gives me a nugget. I said on The Ecclesiastes Project that there were two different groups represented due to the different fates in Rev 12 and 13. Maybe the “woman’s seed” is everybody else but it seems to me that offspring comes from a related “seed.” And this is why apples produce apples, and oranges produce oranges etc. As far as the group who flees, it says those in “Judea.” If it were for every believer, then why would He qualify it by naming a specific location?

      As far as the Greater Exodus, I’ve done a long study on this myself and looked at all of the verses the Greater Exodus proponents give and found that they were all taken out of context. There are pictures in the bible of people doing what God has commanded, like Noah. And if you look at the story of Joseph storing up grain, and if we have this preparedness mentality, then we will see what we WANT to see. We might even think we’re being obedient and emulating scripture. But therein lies the deception because Joseph storing up grain was not a lesson for US to store up food because this is a completely different context with a completely different lesson. And this is where you and I disagree and that’s ok. If we are truly humble, then we will admit that we are wrong on some things and could be wrong on this issue – myself included. But as long as we’re in these corruptible bodies, we must be open to the fact that we don’t have all of the answers and therefore, we should be continuing to learn. If we don’t, then we are stagnant and we don’t grow.

      So for now, we disagree on this issue. One or both of us is wrong. You have done your study and I’ve done mine and have reached a different conclusion. You won’t be able to convince me of anything different right now and vice versa. So this is where we let the Ruach HaKodesh teach us. This is where we must pray and continue to study and look with unbiased eyes. Having a discussion and disagreement is fine but I can tell from your last comment that you are getting upset.

      For instance. You said “they” are refusing to place your comments up when they are proven wrong”.

      You have three comments up over there that he has put up already and from what I see, you haven’t proven anything. (I’m not trying to be snarky, I’m speaking honestly) You two were in the midst of a discussion so you cannot claim victory while the discussion is still taking place. You cannot proclaim a winner if you’re still running the race. So nothing was “proven.”

      You also said that “they refuse to list further comments.” How do you know this? If you’ve put up comments that have not been published, can you really be sure it’s because he’s refusing to publish your comment? How do you know he’s even seen them?

      He said nothing about you spending time on his blog so I don’t know what you’re talking about.

      But let’s just say that you are right and he’s refusing to publish your comment, he reserves the right to do this because it’s his blog. He doesn’t have to give you a platform in which to express your opinion but he was courteous enough to publish your comments anyway. You can create a blog yourself and express your own opinions if you want.

      None of this was said to ‘ruffle your feathers,’ I’m just making an observation based on what I see on his site. You HAVE commented three times and he has answered you. You’ve given no argument yourself except to tell him (and now me) to Google something. You assume he’s refusing to publish your comments even though you see that he has previously published your comments. All I’m saying is that if you’re going to judge, then judge rightly and honestly. You don’t want Satan to get a foothold on you or cause you to sin. And I certainly don’t want to fall into his trap either.

      Blessings and Shalom! 🙂

  8. “..And I certainly don’t want to fall into his trap either..”………Ahhh there you go.:)

    Trousseau – The French diminutive of truss or bundle—the thing that tramps or runaways carry tied to a stick over their shoulders.

    “..All I’m saying is that if you’re going to judge, then judge rightly and honestly..” Oh, and you are so sure that “the project manager” placed all my comments? Then please elaborate on my comment to you which he neither placed.

    I have not made up my mind as to the Greater exodus as yet and are still searching , thats why I landed first on his website and now have discovered yours but needless to say I am pretty sure that I find no guidence on either of your sites.

    Tell me Carol , do you see yourself as part of the 12 tribes ?

    Or are you still seeing yourself as a separate entity called “the church” ? How exactly can you do that if ….>
    Rom 10:12 That means that there is no difference between Jew and Gentile – ADONAI is the same for everyone, rich toward everyone who calls on him,….. ?
    Col 3:11 The new self allows no room for discriminating between Gentile and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, foreigner, savage, slave, free man; on the contrary, in all, the Messiah is everything. ?

    So are you or are you not of the offspring of “the Woman” ?

    • Hello Bob, I didn’t say that he placed ALL of your comments because I don’t know how many you made. I said there are three comments of yours that are up.

      Yes, I believe that I am a part of Israel having “crossed over.” I do NOT believe I am part of a different entity called the church. That’s what the Christians believe. I also believe there is one law, for both Jew and sojourner or anyone who joins themselves to Israel. I believe there is no difference between believing Jew or Gentile, male or female, free or slave etc. What I AM saying is that while we are united in one body, we live separately GEOGRAPHICALLY. Two criteria have to be met:

      1) We must be offspring of the woman.
      2) We must live in Judea.

      So far, being a part of Ephraim, we fit the first criteria but not the second. Can you agree with that? I know you live in South Africa so you MUST concede that you do not live in Judea. So do we ignore the 2nd criteria? Or do we think about this? Then you throw in the DIFFERENCE between the two fates of the Judeans and the nations in Rev 12 & 13. That doesn’t mean we are a divided people spiritually because we are one. But we cannot ignore that it says that one group will flee and be protected, and the other nations (which is by definition anyone that is not Jewish) will be persecuted. You do know that Israel is divided up into two right? The southern tribes consists of Judah and Benjamin. The other ten northern tribes are all the rest consisting of Ephraim. While Ephraim is a part of Israel, they are not Jews. The Jews come from Judea in the southern portion of Israel.

      The fact that there are “two sticks” or “two branches” that will be joined together shows you that all of Israel is not joined together physically because Ephraim is still scattered but we ARE joined together in spirit because we are one body. When I first learned this, it was confusing for me but I get it now.

      So back to the offspring. Since we in Ephraim only fit one criteria, that we are offspring, yet we DON’T live in Judea, then what are we to conclude? I think that there are more offspring in Judea that do NOT flee. Not everyone in Judea believes in Yeshua. In fact Rabbinical Judaism is vehemently against this teaching so do you think THEY will flee? They don’t even read the New Testament. They mainly read the Mishnah and the Talmud which is filled with Rabbinical writings. And on a secondary note, they read Torah and the Prophets but never the New Testament. Does any of this make sense to you? I’m trying to explain as best as I can. Blessings and Shalom!

  9. Carol,

    Q: When our Father shakes the olive tree, will only the “Jewish” branches shake ? I believe that I have been grafted into that tree as Shaul states in the B’rit Chadashah.

    As I have stated previously, I would really like having a “diplomatic” conversation about the coming greater exodus as I have not yet made up my mind as to the precise timing for leaving “Egypt”.

    Our backpacks are packed with food etc. for 30 days[manna after 30 days], and we are awaiting the signs that I have analized as being : When you throw a stone into a pond the ripple effect takes time to reach shore?

    Likewise our Father will cast a stone into the pond in Israel and Yeshua explains that the Judeans are to flee to the wilderness. This fleeing will in my mind be caused when Judea/Jurusalem is overrun by Islamites and these islamites force all people in Israel to convert to Islam and therefore the people accepting alla into their “Bodily Temples” when converting to Islam, causing the abomination to be set up in the Temple of our Father.

    We are awaiting certain ripple effects with what is to happen in Israel :
    1. 30% of Oil passing through Straits of hormus will become unavailable to the West.
    2. No food will be delivered to shops , no money to Banks.
    3. Industry shuts down.

    The above ripple-effects of “the stone in the pond” is when we leave the city with our Backpacks , heading for the mountains.

    Ps. We leave a fully paid off home with all its contents behind.

    Madness eh?

    Rob.

    • The warning states that “those in Judea” must flee, “Judea” being the key word here. It has nothing to do with your exclusion or inclusion because you’re grafted in. This is talking about the people who actually live in Judea exactly like Matthew states. There is no call to flee for anyone else who lives in any other part of the world. The believing Judeans have a special set of instructions because I believe:
      That is where the abomination will take place
      They are the ones surrounded by their enemies
      They are the physical descendants or offspring of the ‘woman giving birth.’
      We are not in the same predicament.

      I think the bible means what it says plainly. Spiritual Israel (those grafted in) do not factor into this particular instruction.
      As for the ripple effect – no doubt there will be one. Everything will be affected eventually. But there is no instruction for anyone else to flee anywhere else in the world. I think I mentioned in a previous comment what everyone else in the world is to expect during that time.

      Disclaimer…given the time we’re privileged to live in, and given the fact that prophecy will become more clear as we see these things unravel, I think we must be open to things playing out differently than what we imagined or have been taught. The closer we get to the end, the more understanding He will give us. So we must allow for the good possibility that we are wrong on many things. I believe certain things to be true now, but I’m constantly studying and watching the news and prophecy unfold. I could change my mind in the future and if I’m wrong, then I’ll definitely change it. 🙂

      Blessings – Carol

  10. Mar 13:14 (cjb) “Now when you see the abomination that causes devastation standing where it ought not to be” (let the reader understand the allusion), “that will be the time for those in Y’hudah to escape to the hills.

    “Now when you see the 0bama of another nation[America] that causes devastation with wars, standing where he ought not to be @Temple mount/wall (let the reader understand the allusion), “that will be the time for those in Y’hudah to escape to the hills.
    ——————————————————————————————————–

    Hamas and Islamic Jihad say that a visit by Obama to the Temple Mount will be a declaration of war on the Islamic world.
    http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/166024

    Hundreds of Palestinians riot on Temple Mount, as talk of ‘Third Intifada’ grows
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/mar/8/hundreds-palestinians-riot-temple-mount-talk-third/

    Muslim mob prevents Jews from visiting Temple Mount http://www.israeltoday.co.il/NewsItem/tabid/178/nid/23715/Default.aspx?hp=readmore

    • I think O’s visit has everyone’s attention, including mine. There is a lot of speculation as to what may transpire but it is all speculation. We will just have to wait and see what Father does. 🙂

  11. Can there be a middle ground on this? I also do not concur with the concept of my physical planning and orchestrating any “exodus” of my own. I too see the wisdom of what preparation means and I believe that the Hebrews knew full well that Moshe was asking Paroah to let them go. Wouldn’t they have been preparing if that were to ever occur? They had wagons, animals, tents/sukkahs, etc.

    So what if the greater exodus is a part of the creation of Zion? What if Y’shua returns to teach the woman in the wilderness (Yudah) and then as he approaches from Edom He calls out for the angels to gather His elect from the four corners?

    The woman in Rev 12 is taken to safety on the wings of an eagle, just as the Hebrews were in the original escape from Miztraim. Could there be a similar occurence with regard to the remnant of Ephraim?

    Yeah, some have gone too far in trying to “push” Elohim’s plan along. That is dangerous and unwise, we are supossed to wait and be patient in Him.

    Basically what I am saying is this. I think folks here are maybe polarizing concepts? Does that make sense? There are so many options, so many parts and pieces to this whole thing. Making all “greater exodus” believers into having to subscribe to one thought leaves no room for those of us who are still learning and the more we learn the more we realize we need to learn more.

    I do think that there will be a greater exodus occurence. I do beleive that it affects those who are ‘kept safe’ while in the midst of tribulation. Does that mean only Ephraim? Does that consitute another group outside of the remnants of Ephraim and Yudah? I don’t know, would love to discuss and learn and am open to modifying what I think I know right now in favor of knowing Y’shua better.

    Just thought I would add this little bit. Totally my opinion, no requirement for agreement.

    Be blessed

  12. I appreciate some of these comments, most especially Stephens. None of us are YHVH, so none of us has perfect knowledge…and it would be wise to keep that in mind. We share what we have discovered, through our own study and through relying on the study of others. None of us are totally firm in what we think that we understand. Give Tim McHyde’s newsletter a look…it’s escapeallthesethings.com…and he has a slightly different scenario to offer, but his book “Know the Future” is worth the read. If I recall, he teaches that there will be a near flyby of “Wormwood”, mentioned in the book of Revelation…which restores the 360 day year and 30 moonth, which fits with the 42 moonths, 3 1/2 years and 1260 days…fits perfectly! Most eschatology teachers simply ignore Wormwood. I could give other information that he emphasizes, but it is better for any of you to check it out yourself. What he says can be scarey, but also comforting. It will require faith to know what to do and when to do it….who to listen to. He says that there will be 4 end time groups, the marked, the martyred, the woman and the 144,000. He wants us to ask ourselves, “which group will we be in?” Our Father, Yehovah, Creator and Sustainer of the Universe, will give us wisdom and discernment if we ask for it. “The wise will understand…” Hallelujah! Praise Messiah Yeshua!

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s